Question VR vs Desktop: What is the desktop community missing out on?

[Johninvr]

what a great community!

Bottom Line Up Front: For the VR users, what is your experience like comparative to desktop?

For instance: does VAM support 6DoF? With a Quest 2 are you able to create a play area and freely walk about, and this translates to your position in VAM? Even a possessed Atom?

Does the Quest 2 latest update that tracks hand movement function like a leap motion sensor and work in VAM? Does VAM track individual finger motion or only the hands? Essentially, can you use VAM mostly independent of VR controllers now?

I ask all this because only a few years ago I used VR, but only with 3DoF. I’ve been using VAM for about 2 years now but only with desktop as my computer just isn’t up to speed for VR.
Then a work friend let me try his Quest 2 (not for VAM, just basic games) I was floored! I had no idea the tech had advanced so rapidly in a few years. I was no longer a single spot that could just passively look around; now I could physically walk, sit, lay down and my avatar in VR would do the exact same. Is all this possible in VAM? If so, why would you ever leave the house?

with VR in VAM are you able to physically walk around in your play area and your character does so in VAM, without the need to use a D-pad? Can you stand over/under Atoms and interact with your hands?

what a game changer!!! Please let me know what you all think and experience, as I am about to go all in on a new gaming PC and Quest 2 if all this is possible. I have no idea what I’m missing out on and I think it’s probably aLOT.

 

[Calluhan]

Wow, two years using desktop, you are really missing out. With the latest update on Q2 the vr hands work but you cannot use any menu's or 'click' anything. You can touch and grab the model to move the body parts with VR hands just the same as you can the controllers. With VR hands enabled you can just pick up the controllers and access the menu's and move around -- then put the controllers down and just use your VR hands to touch and grab. Not brilliant but they do work.

I'm not sure if you have this right.... I have a Quest 2 and use it with virtual desktop through steam (using OVR) I have full menu access using the controllers and can manipulate all atom nodes using the grab function of the controllers. I can also use the virtual hands but rarely do. To my mind much more usable and precise than desktop mode. As I say, not sure if I'm reading your post right but I have full functionality in VAM. The way your post reads it seems you need the controller customisation that steam vr provides (there is a native configuration which works perfectly). Again, apologies if I have read your post incorrectly

 

[T_bob]

I'm not sure if you have this right.... I have a Quest 2 and use it with virtual desktop through steam (using OVR) I have full menu access using the controllers and can manipulate all atom nodes using the grab function of the controllers. I can also use the virtual hands but rarely do. To my mind much more usable and precise than desktop mode. As I say, not sure if I'm reading your post right but I have full functionality in VAM. The way your post reads it seems you need the controller customisation that steam vr provides (there is a native configuration which works perfectly). Again, apologies if I have read your post incorrectly

 

[T_bob]

We were talking about VR hands and of course the controllers work with full functionality.

 

[Calluhan]

OK I'll get my coat

 

[HolySchmidt]

Bottom Line Up Front: For the VR users, what is your experience like comparative to desktop?

Like someone already said: not comparable.
VR is like reality compared to a flat screen. Kind of. Of course it's not LIKE reality, but it tricks your brain in believing it's real, but YOU know it isn't.

The biggest immersion killer I think is still the binocular effect, depending on what hardware you get. Research FOV and IPD before buying one!

Pimax has the biggest FOV and I'm still very interested in what this changes to the immersion. Anyone in here can tell?
I own a Valve Index, so no complains from my side

So, answering the thread title: everything. Really.

 

[T_bob]

OK I'll get my coat

no probs and please don't leave

 

[LooksHunter]

Adjusting models and moving through a scene are much better in VR, and obviously the immersion, but I have found that possessing a male model to move around and interact with models is extremely awkward even with Vive trackers, unless I just use the hands, but I bet it just another thing with a steep learning curve that can be made easier with right plugin combination.

The overal experience is great, just don't expect you will hassle free walk through scenes, I'm happy just being a floating ghost most of the time.

 

[TToby]

VaM is just made for VR. Some would even say, VR is made for exactly something like VaM.
It is IMHO a good, but many times also an awkward, bad optimized and difficult "game" for people who just wants to quickly consume. It is a wild wet fantasy comes true for all dreamers, creators and tinkerers.

 

[VamBlaster]

I find it's much easier to build a scene in desktop mode and then use VR to "experience" it.

 

[Lione]

Hand Tracking works good as
Jiraiya already mentioned.

I use it often with the Quest 2.
Once i lay my controllers down my VR Hands appear and can be used.

Although i experience a bit of Lag sometimes depending on the Scene and Render Resolution.
And its for Play Mode currently.

What must be fixed is that Desktop created Scenes often do no longer match in VR.
If MOCAP or manual animated.
So often the GENS are slipped out or Positions are ruined once loaded in VR.

Or the Camera is at a entire different Location than it has been created in Desktop so you need to then start to find your character .
Thats a real pain and a immersion breaker for me.
Dunno if its creators fault here in a workflow but i really wonder about that behavior.

The cam re setup could be a ok situation but that the GENS are not fitted anymore in a Sex Scene is a NOGO for me.

Sure VAM is still awesome but it has some really annoying behaviors here and there.

 

[TToby]

Or the Camera is at a entire different Location than it has been created in Desktop

I was asking myself why some scenes were starting at an absolutely nonsens point like in the middle of a wall... this is the answer! Lol. Thank you Lione!

 

[Jiraiya]

It's mainly from assets that have a camera in them....
In unity when you export an asset you can export the camera position and lights too. If you do this, it screws up VaM a lot.
Testing in desktop mode works, but when you go to VR the extra camera or lights screw things up. There are also settings that need to be changed for things to work correctly in VR not desktop mode. If the creator forgets to set them and doesn't test in VR..... BOOM.
PostMagic is also evil and screws up a lot of scenes in VR. I deleted the plugin completely now.

 

[TToby]

That makes sense.
Isn't it one of the first things they will teach you in the cua tutorials, to remove lights and camera when setting up the basic Unity scene for VaM?
I have to defend PostMagic. It isn't evil, but has some optional functions that doesn't work in VR. I guess it is even written in the description within the plugin itself. If someone is using them for his desktop scene, it will not work for the VR people. So it is neither the fault of Unity nor PostMagic, but of the scene creators... though, if they don't have VR, they can't do tests before sharing, or maybe they don't care because they are sharing those scenes for free and with no warranty.

 

[Johninvr]

Wow, two years using desktop, you are really missing out. With the latest update on Q2 the vr hands work but you cannot use any menu's or 'click' anything. You can touch and grab the model to move the body parts with VR hands just the same as you can the contollers. With VR hands enabled you can just pick up the controllers and access the menu's and move around -- then put the controllers down and just use your VR hands to touch and grab. Not brilliant but they do work.

I finally did the full system upgrade and as others stated, the experience is near religious.
The one thing I haven’t figured out yet is how to get the native Quest 2 hand tracking software to work using VAM. So far I have only been able to have the controllers act as virtual hands, it seems as soon as I use the Oculus air link I lose the hand tracking ability.
Any recommendations or suggestions? Is it still working for you?

 

[Jiraiya]

You are probably using SteamVR or the Oculus app itself, I don't think either of these correctly work with hand tracking in VaM.
In Virtual Desktop however it "just works". You turn on the "auto switch when putting controllers down" option for ease of use and your hands just work in game.
I launch VaM directly through VD without getting the Oc app or SteamVR involved at all (saves a few FPS) and also use the image improvement features in VD that are better than the other two such as Spacewarp and sharpening.
There is also ALVR which is free and open source, I believe hand tracking works in that but I have not tested it myself yet.

 

[Johninvr]

You are probably using SteamVR or the Oculus app itself, I don't think either of these correctly work with hand tracking in VaM.
In Virtual Desktop however it "just works". You turn on the "auto switch when putting controllers down" option for ease of use and your hands just work in game.
I launch VaM directly through VD without getting the Oc app or SteamVR involved at all (saves a few FPS) and also use the image improvement features in VD that are better than the other two such as Spacewarp and sharpening.
There is also ALVR which is free and open source, I believe hand tracking works in that but I have not tested it myself yet.

Perfect, thanks!! Yeah I was using the Oculus Air Link

 

[Lione]

If you experience any weird flickers using Virtual Desktop while loading content which could be caused by still using Oculus or Steam launchers
then open notepad and add the correct matching paths for

VirtualDesktop.Streamer.exe + your path for VAM.exe

Example:

"C:\Virtual Desktop Streamer\VirtualDesktop.Streamer.exe" "S:\VAM\VaM.exe"

or

"C:\programm files\virtual desktop streamer\VirtualDesktop.Streamer.exe" "S:\VirtaMate\VaM.exe"

or wherever you installed the VD Streamer App to and keep the " " as they are . Do not remove them.

Then save your textfile as

vam_launcher.bat

You can name it whatever you like, but care its prefix is .bat

I put that on my Desktop so its easy to use it doubleclicking once VD opens my desktop.

It then launches VAM without any more flashes or flickers which annoys so many people.

 

[Jiraiya]

^This.
That is exactly how I launch VaM and it prevents the horrible stuttering during any load that made me want to vomit before.
It also lets the hand tracking work if you launch it that way.

 

[Johninvr]

Thanks Lione and Jiraiya! I’ll download Virtual Desktop this weekend and get setup right

 

[Jiraiya]

VD is a paid app. It might be worth trying ALVR first as that's free and open source.
(I bought VD, I love it. Always worth trying free too though).

 

[HolySchmidt]

I finally did the full system upgrade and as others stated, the experience is near religious.

That's blasphemy says the Holy One! Burn in VR hell for the next week, see ya and have fun!

 

[Johninvr]

That's blasphemy says the Holy One! Burn in VR hell for the next week, see ya and have fun!

my first ride in I burned Quest 2 from full charge, immersed in my favorite scenes I had built for years in beautiful high def virtual reality.

THAT was the ultimate VAM experience. I was already intimately familiar with VAM for years, but finally got to go INTO it.

Once my battery failed and I took my headset off I was actually shocked for a moment to see that my model was not sitting in a chair next to me, that it was in fact a blank open area of my room. For over two hours she felt as real as it gets without being reality. Even the room, the furniture.

This is without a doubt the best VR experience.

 

[HolySchmidt]

Felt similar for me at the beginning. After some time the first "wow" effect is gone but still, after one year of use, I don't got used to the 3D effect. And that's what you can't explain in words to all 2D users, you have to experience for yourself. And then you know ... you saw god.

Kidding!

But it really is another dimension.

 

[LooksHunter]

PostMagic is also evil and screws up a lot of scenes in VR. I deleted the plugin completely now.

I have a special plugin preset, loading it disables the crosseye effect and I can enjoy a scene. Always a bummer when it happens though

 

[Johninvr]

If you experience any weird flickers using Virtual Desktop while loading content which could be caused by still using Oculus or Steam launchers
then open notepad and add the correct matching paths for

VirtualDesktop.Streamer.exe + your path for VAM.exe

Example:

"C:\Virtual Desktop Streamer\VirtualDesktop.Streamer.exe" "S:\VAM\VaM.exe"

or

"C:\programm files\virtual desktop streamer\VirtualDesktop.Streamer.exe" "S:\VirtaMate\VaM.exe"

or wherever you installed the VD Streamer App to and keep the " " as they are . Do not remove them.

Then save your textfile as

vam_launcher.bat

You can name it whatever you like, but care its prefix is .bat

I put that on my Desktop so its easy to use it doubleclicking once VD opens my desktop.

It then launches VAM without any more flashes or flickers which annoys so many people.

So I ran into a few major roadblocks with Virtual Desktop:

First off, I get very glitchy, stuttering hand tracking when I opened VAM in VD for the first time. It technically works, but not very enjoyable. I did discover that steamVR is running in the background so I assumed that was the culprit.

I tried running a .bat file like you recommended, however it only runs in a desktop style mode even in my headset when Steam/SteamVR isn’t running. Even worse, for some reason when I run the .bat file it starts a free version of VAM instead of my creator version with my thousands of preinstalled VARS, etc, so there’s literally no scenes at all. Just a blank canvas. Not even an intro scene, weirdly enough.


that scared the crap out of me, for a moment I thought I had lost EVERYTHING, lol.

I got it running again, but the same issue of VD still seems to rely on SteamVR in order to activate the VR function of VAM, not just the desktop mode.

What am I missing? Any recommendations?