I'm apologize if I'm asking a question that has been answered. I've watched some tutorials, but pretty sure I don't have the hardware to run the software in the first place. So I'd like to get that set up first so I can follow along and start playing around with it and learn. I'm VERY inexperienced with this technology. I mean, like, when you answer, imagine you're talking to your grandfather who doesn't even have a smart phone. What can you recommend for hardware? Preferably a laptop if that's possible since I travel a lot, VR controls and other hardware. Please use small words and the less abbreviations, the better. Thank you.
Hardware recommendations
- Thread starter case762
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It depends a lot on what you want to spend. Some notes about laptops:
Also note that it is currently a rather bad time to buy PC hardware. Prices especially for graphics cards are ridiculously high. For example the official price for an RTX3080 according to Nvidia is 719€ in my country, including VAT. Actual price in the shops is more like 1300-1400€.
- Generally more expensive
- Generally slower due to limited ability to draw power
- Generally slower due to limited ability to get rid of heat
- Generally louder because of 3.
Also note that it is currently a rather bad time to buy PC hardware. Prices especially for graphics cards are ridiculously high. For example the official price for an RTX3080 according to Nvidia is 719€ in my country, including VAT. Actual price in the shops is more like 1300-1400€.
LooksHunter
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Interesting, can't imagine VaM VR travel kit tbh. Popping in for a quickie in a hotel room or something? Sadly currently VaM is really unforgiving hardware vise, as in there is little gain from meeting minimal requirements and then climbing up to top end - a lot of users reported low gains from upgrading their rigs. So actually good news is if you don't mind low settings and lowish FPS you can get away with something less robust, as long as you keep your scenes simple. Also VaM is a lot like MMORPG in a sense that it takes a lot of time and commitment to learn new functions. It is very rewarding to do so, but it ain't easy process. Still, even collecting scenes, looks and clothes is a ton of fun. But there is a lot of frustration involved. It's a steep learning curve.
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@case762 I can support everything MacGruber said for 100%.
Very good explanation!
Question: What hardware do you allready have? How old is your PC? Is it a gaming PC or an office PC?
Maybe you can use at least some of the parts.
We need the name and type of your GPU/graphic card and of your CPU/Processor. You can find them in your Windows 10 system settings, for instance.
If you don't have a separate graphic card but only using the build-in stuff of your CPU, we can keep it short... you will definitely need a dedicated GPU
Unfortunately VR needs a very powerfull PC. Not compareable with only playing some older games on a standard monitor screen. The higher resolution the VR headset has, the more ambitious you are, the more power you will need.
You would need a upper-middleclass graphiccard only for the start. Many of us have the biggest gaming GPUs you can buy, in a big case with good ventilation.
CPU: starting from any i7 with 4 cores not older than 7 years.
GPU: starting from a (old to new) NVIDIA gtx 980ti, or gtx 1070, or gtx 1080, or rtx 2060, or rtx 2070, or 3060, or 3070. I am no expert for AMD GPUs, i know only the last generation and would start at least from Radeon 6700.
RAM: 16 GB (Memory)
You will also need a big harddisk or better a SSD (much faster).
Above are the minimum hardware requirements in my humble opinion. Bigger is better.
Maybe you can give us a clue, how much money you want to spend.
As MacGruber said, unfortunately computer stuff is very expensive at the moment.
Maybe you can buy a used one from a friend for cheap?
Very good explanation!
Question: What hardware do you allready have? How old is your PC? Is it a gaming PC or an office PC?
Maybe you can use at least some of the parts.
We need the name and type of your GPU/graphic card and of your CPU/Processor. You can find them in your Windows 10 system settings, for instance.
If you don't have a separate graphic card but only using the build-in stuff of your CPU, we can keep it short... you will definitely need a dedicated GPU
Unfortunately VR needs a very powerfull PC. Not compareable with only playing some older games on a standard monitor screen. The higher resolution the VR headset has, the more ambitious you are, the more power you will need.
You would need a upper-middleclass graphiccard only for the start. Many of us have the biggest gaming GPUs you can buy, in a big case with good ventilation.
CPU: starting from any i7 with 4 cores not older than 7 years.
GPU: starting from a (old to new) NVIDIA gtx 980ti, or gtx 1070, or gtx 1080, or rtx 2060, or rtx 2070, or 3060, or 3070. I am no expert for AMD GPUs, i know only the last generation and would start at least from Radeon 6700.
RAM: 16 GB (Memory)
You will also need a big harddisk or better a SSD (much faster).
Above are the minimum hardware requirements in my humble opinion. Bigger is better.
Maybe you can give us a clue, how much money you want to spend.
As MacGruber said, unfortunately computer stuff is very expensive at the moment.
Maybe you can buy a used one from a friend for cheap?
HolySchmidt
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Key-question is: what are you willing to spend on it? Because, the more, the better, of course.
If you really wanna do this on a laptop, which technically should be no problem, then I would recommend:
16GB RAM (or even 32GB)
SSD (1 TB)
RTX 3080
Intel or AMD 8-core Processor with a high single-core frequenzy (4,6GHz and above), named turbo boost mostly.
This would be around 2800€ in my country, which is around 3300$ USD.
But I can't tell you how it will run on a laptop like this. If this would be a PC, you'd be fine.
What I wouldn't recommend is an ATI graphics card, because Nvidia is on the better performance side concerning VR from what I know and experienced.
MacGruber is of course right with what he said. This would be a noisy, hot piece of technique I assume. But that's the problem with all high end technique: the more performance, the more heat, the more noise.
I personally would also watch out for 17" screen and an IPS panel maybe. But that's personal taste.
If I were you, I would definitely check out some tests online before blind-buying one and would be focussed on heat and ventilation. There's a big difference in different laptops regarding spreading the heat (on how many copper pipes) and what kind of airflow the manufacterer designed for their models. This is essential for the level of noise.
If you really wanna do this on a laptop, which technically should be no problem, then I would recommend:
16GB RAM (or even 32GB)
SSD (1 TB)
RTX 3080
Intel or AMD 8-core Processor with a high single-core frequenzy (4,6GHz and above), named turbo boost mostly.
This would be around 2800€ in my country, which is around 3300$ USD.
But I can't tell you how it will run on a laptop like this. If this would be a PC, you'd be fine.
What I wouldn't recommend is an ATI graphics card, because Nvidia is on the better performance side concerning VR from what I know and experienced.
MacGruber is of course right with what he said. This would be a noisy, hot piece of technique I assume. But that's the problem with all high end technique: the more performance, the more heat, the more noise.
I personally would also watch out for 17" screen and an IPS panel maybe. But that's personal taste.
If I were you, I would definitely check out some tests online before blind-buying one and would be focussed on heat and ventilation. There's a big difference in different laptops regarding spreading the heat (on how many copper pipes) and what kind of airflow the manufacterer designed for their models. This is essential for the level of noise.
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I'd like to add that VAM is also working and very interesting to use in non-VR mode (desktop mode).
A good gaming laptop will be more than enough to run it. And you don't have to bother travelling with the VR headset and controllers!
My advice would be: try it this way first. You could enjoy VAM and start to use it. And if your laptop is running smoothly and you feel you're missing out something without VR, then go for it.
A good gaming laptop will be more than enough to run it. And you don't have to bother travelling with the VR headset and controllers!
My advice would be: try it this way first. You could enjoy VAM and start to use it. And if your laptop is running smoothly and you feel you're missing out something without VR, then go for it.
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@case762 Important thing is, that if someone at a shop or the internet is talking about "this is one of the best Gamin Laptops and very powerfull" this isn't exactly our league... 
We unfortunately will need even more power for modern VR headsets. Playing games at a 17 inch full HD laptop screen or an plugged in HD monitor is not comparable with VR. VR is comparable to 4k flat gaming and more.
IMHO A Gamin Laptop is weaker than a Gaming PC, but the laptop is much more expensive.
I am using an AMD (former ATI since 2006) Radeon 6900xt and I love it! Best GPU I ever had, and I was a NVIDIA fan, too. @HolySchmidt
We unfortunately will need even more power for modern VR headsets. Playing games at a 17 inch full HD laptop screen or an plugged in HD monitor is not comparable with VR. VR is comparable to 4k flat gaming and more.IMHO A Gamin Laptop is weaker than a Gaming PC, but the laptop is much more expensive.
I am using an AMD (former ATI since 2006) Radeon 6900xt and I love it! Best GPU I ever had, and I was a NVIDIA fan, too. @HolySchmidt
Thanks all. I'm already learning a lot about computers and hardware. That's part of the fun in all this. I'm not attached to the idea of doing this while traveling on a laptop, but most of my downtime is while on the road. So mobile is better because when I'm home, I have a small farm to deal with. Hard to get into creating scenes on VaM when there are mouths to feed. But I'd still like to create content that would be fun and interesting not just only for myself, but for others as well.
As far as what I'm willing to spend, I'm open. I don't want to spend the fortune of someone who makes a living off this, but I'm also not hurting in the finance department, so I can be flexible. If I "buy once, cry once" and can create content that myself and others enjoy, and have a quality platform to do it with, then the cost is worth it.
HolySchmidt
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I had an 6800XT before I got my 3080, and it was not as good as the Nvidia in VR. That was some months ago, maybe the drivers are now better. But I had strange stuttering when moving my head in VR. Normal gaming performance was excellent regarding fps, BUT my 6800XT got coile whining from hell. Really. I am very sensitive about noises in general but I'm not like it has to be unhearable. But THIS, and I read the same from a lot of other users with 6800XT, was not acceptable to me and shouldn't be acceptable in general.I am using an AMD (former ATI since 2006) Radeon 6900xt and I love it! Best GPU I ever had, and I was a NVIDIA fan, too. @HolySchmidt
I know, 3000 series has similar problems, an mine is really silent, but from what I read the ATIs are more on the coile whining side than the Nvidias.
Mine was kinda like this:
I got the 3080 (ASUS TUF) and it's damn quiet. I love it! But I know it's a bit like lottery.
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@HolySchmidt Yes, this is always a bit of a lottery. What can be said is, that with our todays 300W high energy monster GPUs, coil whining will be a much more common problem (referring to IgorsLab, don't ask me details). I had a loud whining, too, but only for some hours. Now it is silent. Yes, there were some driver issues at the early days, just like with 3080/90, but almost every two weeks there is a new driver update. There was a little bit stuttering in VR for me, too, but that could be cured by setting some driver options and maybe by Steam updates. Anyways, you can set up so many different things in the AMD drivers, coming from NVIDIA it was a bit overwhelming. Saying this... IMHO many of the issues new AMD users (including me) had, where from the remainings of NVIDIA drivers not being completely being uninstalled. I had to use a deinstall tool three times to kill everything.
@case762 sorry, I am no expert in gaming laptops, I'm out. For mobile use, you most likely want to buy an Oculus (Facebook) VR headset, but I am a SteamVR (Valve Index) fan. Sorry!
@case762 sorry, I am no expert in gaming laptops, I'm out. For mobile use, you most likely want to buy an Oculus (Facebook) VR headset, but I am a SteamVR (Valve Index) fan. Sorry!
Jiraiya
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As far as the VR headset goes I can't speak highly enough of the Quest2. The full inside-out tracking that gives you head track and hand tracking with no cables or base stations etc is honestly amazing. For the price too, I don't think many of the dedicated PC setups can come close.
It's a bit of a lottery with the lenses are are inexcusably cheap.
Not going to argue that there aren't benefits to a lot of the PC systems, I just think for simplicity and price the Quest2 is a good option.
That said, it's not easy to add extra trackers if you want to do more than head/hands.
It's a bit of a lottery with the lenses are are inexcusably cheap.
Not going to argue that there aren't benefits to a lot of the PC systems, I just think for simplicity and price the Quest2 is a good option.
That said, it's not easy to add extra trackers if you want to do more than head/hands.
HolySchmidt
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Quest 2 for me is a no-go thinking of the facebook-account compulsion. Paying with personal data instead of cash.
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As an explanation for newcomers: The Quest2 is highly subsidized by Facebook. Therefore it is cheaper than other VR systems of the same quality. But Facebook is no charity organisation, you will pay with your data as HolySchmidt said. You will need a Facebook account to use it, and if you will use a fake account, Facebook is allowed to ban you and all your games are lost. With that policy, the Quest2 is, for instance, still not allowed to be officially sold in Germany for data-protection reasons. Because the headset is so cheap, it is very popular, but is pushing other manufacturers out of the market with all negative aftermath. Though, for someone who wants to be mobile with a gaming laptop, it is unfortunately hard to find an actual alternative product of the same quality. A HP Reverb 2 has a similar inside-out tracking, that will need no external devices, but is more expensive and has a much too big resolution for laptop user IMHO. More screen resolution means a more powerfull PC is needed. Sure, you could use it with a lower resolution option too, but... who wants to do that?
Edit: The Quest2 is a so called stand-alone headset, that means you can buy and play some specially created simple games directly with no external PC. Though, VaM is not running on that smartphone-like stand-alone system, nor does other more demanding games. Therefore the Quest 2 has a cable to use it with a PC or Laptop like most other VR headsets, too.
Edit: The Quest2 is a so called stand-alone headset, that means you can buy and play some specially created simple games directly with no external PC. Though, VaM is not running on that smartphone-like stand-alone system, nor does other more demanding games. Therefore the Quest 2 has a cable to use it with a PC or Laptop like most other VR headsets, too.
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Jiraiya
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I don't believe you need to worry too much about account banning. As long as you enter basic real information (which they probably already have via shadow accounts).
Link mode should continue to work fine even if your account is banned.
Not going to pretend FB isn't a shitty company with shitty practices that deserve to be in prison for crimes against humanity, they are.
If people want to avoid the Q2 because of Facebook, I applaud your morals. Seriously, no sarcasm. It's nice to see people take a stand on issues such as this. I just wish more people did it so it could make a real difference.
Link mode should continue to work fine even if your account is banned.
Not going to pretend FB isn't a shitty company with shitty practices that deserve to be in prison for crimes against humanity, they are.
If people want to avoid the Q2 because of Facebook, I applaud your morals. Seriously, no sarcasm. It's nice to see people take a stand on issues such as this. I just wish more people did it so it could make a real difference.
keycode
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[OT] I was reading about last generations cards coils troubles some months before I could get my MSI 3070 suprim ... and I think I was enough lucky about this issue (besides fans turbulence when 3d rendering or Vam playing, my card is totally silent), but still I'm curious on this argument.
I remember the first time, a lot lot of youth-years ago, I could almost hear a Beethoven melody [LOL!] just from one of those special big expensive oxygen-free copper inductance I was using for one of my crossover amateur project (feeding the circuit before connecting it to a loudspeaker). Was that (really bad) problem with the 6800 audible only during high power performance (I guess so)? But if you want to smile look at this video AMD Radeon 6800XT GPU Coil Whine - FIX - YouTube ... the smart (?) guy is liking so much to look at his new PSU led lights that he was mounting it with down side reverse so that the poor Corsair (otherwise with the fan spinning just and only at high power as my silent "old" RM850x) is always breathing the hottest hell-point in his case and also fighting the natural dynamic of the warm air inside his case.
keycode
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You know what? Before I was mounting my 3070 I was checking those many micro screws that should block the back-plate (moreover also...) on VRAM cooling pads... and one was practically forgot unscrewed (the robot of the assembly line?) ... so that I could move it easy with my finger
... and before myself, nobody (human?) was never touching the card after the object was leaving the chinese factory.
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HolySchmidt
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@keycode
I have a beQuiet Straight Power 11 750W with 2 GPU power connectors, and with this same PSU I have no trouble running my 3080. I have enough ventilation and the PSUs intake on the downside and the outtake on the backside. So none of this is affecting the GPU in whatsoever case. It was the 6800XT. I mean the 3080 draws even more energy.
I know the problem is solved in some cases by switching the PSU, but more than enough people reported that this did nothing to the noise. I'd say it's simply bad quality control + bad design. I know that "wrapping" the coils in glue should fix the problem, but I spend a lot of money on a product. I want a quality product, and coil whine to me, with that level of noise, is not a sign of quality.
But lets get back to topic.
btw: the more frames I got the more louder was the noise and no, I was not willing to set a frame limiter to solve the problem of a bad product
btw2: card was a XFX 6800XT Merc 319, fucking nice looking card, the best I ever held in my hands, really beautiful piece of technique
I have a beQuiet Straight Power 11 750W with 2 GPU power connectors, and with this same PSU I have no trouble running my 3080. I have enough ventilation and the PSUs intake on the downside and the outtake on the backside. So none of this is affecting the GPU in whatsoever case. It was the 6800XT. I mean the 3080 draws even more energy.
I know the problem is solved in some cases by switching the PSU, but more than enough people reported that this did nothing to the noise. I'd say it's simply bad quality control + bad design. I know that "wrapping" the coils in glue should fix the problem, but I spend a lot of money on a product. I want a quality product, and coil whine to me, with that level of noise, is not a sign of quality.
But lets get back to topic.
btw: the more frames I got the more louder was the noise and no, I was not willing to set a frame limiter to solve the problem of a bad product
btw2: card was a XFX 6800XT Merc 319, fucking nice looking card, the best I ever held in my hands, really beautiful piece of technique
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A last word to coil whining. This can happen to both, NVIDIA 3080/90 and AMD 6800/6900. Surely this has to do with quality and the different manufacturers using different electronic components. My 6900 is directly from AMD.
But it has a cause why we heare so much about whining in this GPU generation. This is because of the extreme high power utilisation of the top gpu models. The current technology is at the very edge of functionability. Don't ask me about the exact technological theories like the Lorentz force leading to this vibrations. But the more electrical power and the higher the frequency of switching (~fps), the higher and louder the whining. This makes this latest GPU generation prone to this issue. Because it is a matter of vibration and therefore of resonant frequencies, it is very difficult to control. Even with quality components, it can be differnt from card to card, maybe from fastening a single screw a little bit more, or from one drop of glue. Igor from Igor'sLab (I like his channel and page a lot), once said: In this generation, every GPU will show whining... it is only a matter of how much this is audible.
It is only a little we can do about this:
But it has a cause why we heare so much about whining in this GPU generation. This is because of the extreme high power utilisation of the top gpu models. The current technology is at the very edge of functionability. Don't ask me about the exact technological theories like the Lorentz force leading to this vibrations. But the more electrical power and the higher the frequency of switching (~fps), the higher and louder the whining. This makes this latest GPU generation prone to this issue. Because it is a matter of vibration and therefore of resonant frequencies, it is very difficult to control. Even with quality components, it can be differnt from card to card, maybe from fastening a single screw a little bit more, or from one drop of glue. Igor from Igor'sLab (I like his channel and page a lot), once said: In this generation, every GPU will show whining... it is only a matter of how much this is audible.
It is only a little we can do about this:
- Actually, coil whine is not a reason for complaint, because it is an electro-technical regularity and normality. In reality, however, a beeping graphics card is still often taken back.
- Replacing the power supply can, with a bit of luck, change the operating parameters so that the resonant frequency is not reached, or a more comfortable frequency is reached for the injured party.
- More or less cooling (coefficient of linear expansion) of the coil material can have a positive effect on the beeping. Therefore, coils are usually not cooled too extensively.
- Frame Limiter or VSync can help to reduce the whining, because the coil is not driven 300 times per second, but e.g. only 60 times. ... but that is something we don't want to do.
My laptop was made in 2018, I think... But it is a MSI i7, with 16 gb ram, Nvidia 2060. It runs VAM but not at full resolution or whatever it's called. I have to put it on medium settings, and that is still working the machine. Also remember to buy a cooling pad. Every gaming laptop I been through over heated fast.
